Id help please

[alanjns]

Had a brilliant day at Leighton Moss today - will blog it later. Was actually taking a pic of a distant Curlew from the Allen hide, got home and started processing the photo's and found this in the background. Needless to say it's out of focus, grainy and colour balance is shot, but I live in hope that someone can offer an id. My own feeling is that it may be an Owl, but that's as far as I go.

Thanks everyone.

[clydebirder]

Looks like a juvenile Marsh Harrier to me, can't get much detail out of the photo but you can see the pale head with darker stripe across the eye and pale leading edge to the inner wing

cheers, John

[alanjns]

Thanks very much John, thought I had a barn Owl there for a moment. The Curlew pic only came out marginally better

[Norfolk Snipe]

Why is it not a juv Hobby?

[clydebirder]

Originally Posted by Norfolk Snipe

Why is it not a juv Hobby?

Juvenile Hobby wouldn't have such an extensive dark area on the head, or pale leading edges to inner wing, doesn't show the broad fingered wing tip obvious on this bird and would have overall slimmer body and wings giving a totally different look

cheers, John

[MIKE THROWER]

JUV PEREGRINE. Note, cheek patches, central head stripe, curved falcon wings.

[clydebirder]

Originally Posted by MIKE THROWER

JUV PEREGRINE. Note, cheek patches, central head stripe, curved falcon wings.

Hi Mike

welcome to the forum

I like your images on the SOC site, I take it you are that same person?

I don't think it's a juv Peregrine, it doesnt have a moustachial stripe and the cream coloured patch on the inner wing isn't right for Peregrine either, neither is the obvious fingered look on the wings (more obvious on the second image). I also must admit to having some niggling doubts about it being a juvenile Marsh Harrier though.

cheers, John

[alanjns]

Hi all,

This is posing a bit of a puzzle.

Since John said he was not 100% certain of Juv Marsh Harrier, I posted it on another forum. So far it's been suggested as:

Juv Marsh Harrier
Juv Hobby
Peregrine
Possibly Merlin

and now this.........

Hello Alan, these are fantastically lucky shots. Well done for noticing the bird in the background. I have attached a mocked-up image of how I think a juv Peregrine would look along side your bird. As you admit, they are pretty poor quality but I feel they give plenty of clues to eliminate all but and an adult (probably male) Goshawk. Firstly, the bulk and shape fit perfectly. It shows the dark grey eye mask, pale supercilium, dark crown, yellow cere, grey upperparts and pale under-primary coverts contrasing with the sparsely barred primaries of an adult Goshawk. A juv Peregrine would show browner upperparts, a bluish cere, a pale forehead, a moustache, more pointed, darker wing tips with heavily barred primaries and densely marked under-primary coverts.
The Lancashire county recorder might be keen to see these shots.

Here is his mocked up image....

[alanjns]

Don't no why the image has come out this big - Neil, if you are able to resize it, please do.

Thanks

[clydebirder]

Hi Alan

Don't know who said that but I am 100% certain it isn't a Goshawk, totaly different JIZZ from the bird in the image, definately not a Merlin or Hobby either, structure and shape wrong for both those species too. Will see if I can bring out any more detail from the image in photoshop and see if if we can solve this once and for all, not making any promises though

cheers, John