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05-10-10, 08:43 AM
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For John when you get the time............
This Shag/Cormorant is puzzling me.
 I originally thought it a Cormorant and then John (Clydebirder) thought it a Shag. The books all say that Shag have a steep forehead and never swim near to the land..........this one was under a jetty and the forehead doesn't look steep to me.....or is it just the angle of the pic? Also the white patch is confusing me?? Could you explain for us all why it's a Shag and not a Cormorant John.......many thanks! 
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05-10-10, 11:42 AM
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cheers mike  ......The Shag should have a crowned peak at the front of the headThe Cormorant should have the same peak but at the rear Im sure John - Dennis or - Mike will correct me if Im wrong Hope that helps but need a head crop!!
__________________
Sometimes its better to listen than to talk# http://darksidewoodburning.weebly.com
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05-10-10, 12:20 PM
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05-10-10, 02:38 PM
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I would tend to agree there with Peter Ruth.....in respect of the Bill area Coloration on that point only!!!! Could be wrong......so I say Cormorant Cheers Mike Thanks for the crop photo Ruth Just looked again there is a slight Raised Crown almost in line with the Eye !!! Can you see it on the cropped photo Its the other Eye lid Sorry
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Sometimes its better to listen than to talk# http://darksidewoodburning.weebly.com Last edited by Winterkoning; 05-10-10 at 02:42 PM.
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05-10-10, 07:09 PM
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The shag has a distinct tuft of feathers on its crown so it's a Cormorant to me.
Here's one I took on Isle of May. The feathers sticking out are the immediate noticeable diffence between the Cormorant and Shag. The front one is a Juvenile. The adult is the one sticking its head round. 
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05-10-10, 08:17 PM
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It could be his tuft is slicked back as he has just come up from a dive or put too much Brylcream on that morning. The jaw markings are very Shag though.
I'm confusing myself here - Dam you google!!!
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06-10-10, 08:32 AM
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I still think John is correct and that it's a Shag......the one in my pic had been diving and was wet so the head shape isn't right but the jaw markings seem right to me and when it dived it jump dived.....another point for Shag.
Also the jaw markings are identical to the juv Shag in your image Maggie!
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06-10-10, 11:27 AM
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The features that point to juvenile Shag as opposed to cormorant are, small head, slender kneck, lack of gular pouch (usually orange and very obvious on juv Cormorant), and overall, smaller size and sandier brown colouring. The bill is slightly open in your photo making it look deeper than it actually is but cormorant has an even heavier bill than that. Juvenile Shag almost always show a white/whitish throat patch so that isn't unusual. The head shape can change with activity & posture and should be observed over a period of time, Cormorants tend to look bulkier at the head and kneck which at close range is pretty obvious. Shag are often seen close inshore and normaly prefer rocky coastlines to sandy ones but they can be found along sandy shores too. They sometimes turn up inland and I have seen one at the SECC swimming in the Clyde along the banks of the river, this is quite far up the river where books would say you wouldnt find them. below are some photos for illustration. Below, juv Cormorant, note orange gular pouch at base of bill, shape of head and size of bill.  Below: juv Shag at SECC, further up the river than a book would tell you they occur.  Below: adult Shag, note the rounded head shape in this pic  hope this helps, cheers, John
__________________
Take only photographs, leave only footprints....................................... For wildlife information in the Clyde Recording Area see ... -clydebirds-
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06-10-10, 02:09 PM
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Very much so,thanks very much for clarifying the details John........great pics too!
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