Gull ID?

[alanjns]

Originally Posted by RoyW__

This is book is the current 'standard' text for identification of northern hemisphere gulls, but I wouldn't really recommend it as a beginners book. The revised edition of the Collins Bird Guide is probably all that many birdwatchers will need - and even with the Olsen & Larsson book there are often individuals that even hardened 'Larophiles' can't identify!


And yes, the gull in the photo is a Lesser Black-backed (a summer plumaged adult of the graellsii race, which breeds in the UK).

I think this is somewhat pretentious and undermines the intelligence of forum members - it's a damn good book - I still highly recommend it.

[RoyW__]

Originally Posted by alanjns

I think this is somewhat pretentious and undermines the intelligence of forum members - it's a damn good book - I still highly recommend it.

I'm sorry that you feel that way, but I'm afraid that I really don't understand why you do.
It looks like I'll have to think very carefully before posting anything else on this forum to avoid inadvertently causing offence.


In explanation of my earlier post:
The Malling Olsen & Larsson gull ID guide is indeed a superb book, and I would also highly recommend it. I stand by what I said though, it is not a book that I would recommend to beginners - not because they won't understand it, simply because the bulk of the information that it contains is not necessary for the identification of the vast majority of gulls in the UK (or Europe). The revised Collins guide contains enough information for the identification of all but the most difficult individual gulls, as well as birds from all other families, and can be bought at a fraction of the price. For complete beginners I would usually not even recommend the Collins guide - the RSPB Handbook of British birds more than adequately covers the identification of birds that are likely to be seen in the UK, including 12 gull species (but not Caspian, unless it is in the latest edition), leaving out many of the species covered by Collins that are far less likely to be encountered here. I know from experience of leading birdwatching walks and volunteering to show people birds on reserves etc, that most people find it less confusing if their guides illustrate a smaller number of species/races (leaving out the ones that they are generally unlikely to have seen so that they can concentrate on learning the features of the more common species) - they then move 'up' to more detailed guides as their knowledge increases. There is nothing wrong with being a beginner and, in my opinion, nothing insulting about pointing beginners (I home Peter doesn't object to being called a beginner...) away from sources of information which are more detailed than they need.


Perhaps you objected to the fact that I said the gull was a summer plumaged adult of the graellsii race? (which I added after the original post, just as confirmation of the ID that others had given with a little extra information).
The mention of summer plumage and race may have seemed unnecessary, and could even be viewed as showing off, but it wasn't meant like that - simply saying that it was a Lesser Black-backed Gull and leaving it at that, didn't seem worthwhile because others had already said that much. I could have explained why it was that race/plumage, but posts on internet forums are often brief and, as I do credit other forum members with intelligence, I assumed that it would be possible for anyone who was interested to look it up (and/or ask for further explanation).
I don't regret pointing out the race, because it is an important consideration in gull identification, and helps explain why the bird in Peters photo doesn't have a black back (compare with Rays photo of a much darker backed individual - which is probably a Scandinavian 'intermedius' LB-b Gull, and is closer in colour to Great Black-backed).
Both races are covered in both Collins and the RSPB guide, although with only a small illustration in Collins, and without mention of the scientific names in the RSPB guide (I guess that they may credit beginner birdwatchers with less intelligence than I do?).

[alanjns]

This is a great forum and all contributions add to the mix. I was simply stating my opinion, no offence was either taken or meant.

[RoyW__]

To make my position clear, for a beginner, or intermediate, level birdwatcher with £40 to spend (the price of a new copy of the gull guide), my recommendations would be:
"The RSPB Handbook to British Birds" (about £5-10)
"The 2010 revised edition of The Collins Bird Guide" (about £10 or so)
and a secondhand copy of long out of print "The Macmillan Field Guide to Bird Identification" (up to about £25, but I notice Amazon currently has some advertised for less than £7).

The MacMillan guide covers the identification of difficult species pairs/groups (eg. gulls, Cormorant/Shag, Willow Warbler/Wood Warbler/Chiffchaff and is aimed at British birders.
Recommended to anyone who hasn't got a copy.

For anyone who has decided that they really want to get to grips with gull identification then the Helm guide to "Gulls of Europe, Asia and North America" is certanly highly recommended.
A word of warning if you look for a secondhand copy though - there were some problems with the initial printing which led to quite a few photos being transposed (and therefore captioned as the wrong species). Those who bought copies were given a new one by the publishers if they sent back the title page - so secondhand copies may not be as useful as they should (best to make sure that you seek out a copy of the corrected edition!).

[Vogelmeister]

I have 6 Birdwatching books. The one I keep with me almost always is "The New Birdwatchers Pocket Guide to Britain and Europe" (Bounty Books) by Peter Hayman & Rob Hume.(ISBN.13:978-0-753714-54-6) £9.99 but I can't remember where it came from!! The illustrations are superb, and it fits in my pocket!!

[PeterB]

So, as a beginner (and I will consier myself one for at least 10 years Roy). This simple chart, if there anything hopless about it, as a start, a simple, a quick guide.